The art of having my cake and eating it too
Last year, at Counter-Currents Greg Johnson wrote:
To win this battle, it might be necessary for some of us to become monsters who cannot return to normal society to enjoy the fruits of victory. We need leaders who are willing to sacrifice their immortal souls to this cause. I don’t believe there is an immortal soul, but psychologically speaking what passes for it are immortal scruples or absolute principles other than victory. All these need to be slain and sacrificed on the altar of victory.
Sounds pretty Linderite to me! Himmler and his SS henchmen would be proud of Greg’s words at the esoteric meetings celebrating the summer and winter solstice in Nuremberg.
But at Alex Linder’s own forum a few days ago Greg rebuked me for taking seriously William Pierce’s ethnic cleansing fantasies once the white revolutionaries take over (“…and Pierce’s absurd Nordicism and repugnant exterminationism have only reinforced my sense that something about your critical faculties is not quite right”).
I am tempted to argue in coming entries, perhaps at the Addenda, that the late Pierce, not the more conservative figures in today’s pro-white movement, held the upper moral ground. But first I’d like to say something more about
Unlike the later Nietzsche, it seems that Greg still subscribes Christian doctrine and, inadvertently, Christian axiology too, i.e., the inversion of values. This is the diametric opposite of the indented quotation above. Consciously or unconsciously, I believe that Greg lies to himself and his readership by claiming that he already left Christianity behind.
See for example what he said in a December, 2010 lecture at the Swedenborgian Church of San Francisco. Alas for Greg, the lecture was recently “outed” in the pro-white community, much to his embarrassment. At the Swedenborgian meeting Greg Johnson said:
“What most inspired me was his [Swedenborg’s] discussion of the life of Christ and the meaning and the mystery of that… Swedenborg gave us the means to understand that mystery.”
After quoting Scripture Greg asked, “What does it mean to say that ‘God is with us’?” and went into a theological peroration where he added:
“…a child was born. A child that somehow was the God of eternity. This unique incarnation is the great mystery. It is the conundrum of theologians and metaphysicians. Why was Jesus born? Why did God become man? Swedenborg claims that this was not part of Plan A… Jesus was Plan B… because of certain contingencies that [should not have] happened.”
Greg then used autobiographical vignettes mentioning his childhood and his father to illustrate “Plan B,” presumably what God felt obliged to do when mankind fell into the original sin. He even mentioned the word “salvation.” At some point Greg seemed to endorse the infinitely monstrous—the real monstrosity, not my endorsement of Pierce’s views—belief that it’s within God’s freedom to send us to Hell. (As an aside, see my theological piece on eternal damnation here.) After speculating on the Second Coming, Greg finished his lecture with an “Amen” and the Swedenborgians started to pray.
Listen to the audio linked above to hear, in Greg’s own voice, the above thoughts. Greg’s lecture sounds like the Catholic doctrine I was taught as a kid before my First Communion.
Apparently, Greg has two personas. He is a Nietzschean at Counter-Currents and a pious Christian at his church in San Francisco. He literally had it both ways before his activities with the Swedenborgians were outed. As to his other persona, take note of what Greg Johnson commented this year at The Occidental Observer:
[Christianity] did undermine racial exclusivity for nearly 2,000 years. Racial and subracial differences were no bar to marriage, as long as both parties were Christian.
And at another blog:
Christianity will not be dead until its secular offspring, liberal universalism, is dead as well. But you know that, don’t you? Christian fanatics are precisely the ones who believe that blood differences don’t matter.
I wonder what would his Swedenborgians friends say if they hit in the internet these impious comments (see my brief collection of anti-Christian comments authored by Greg here).
My purpose here is not to psychoanalyze Greg but to show that, with his kind of closet Christianity, he is not the genuine Nietzschean that I previously thought. Given his doublethink I even doubt that Greg can be a consistent leader in advancing the nationalist agenda. Just compare his Himmler-like advice that could have been taught at Wewelsburg Castle (“To win this battle it might be necessary for some of us to become monsters…”) with his more recent pronouncements (“…and Pierce’s absurd Nordicism and repugnant exterminationism”).
OK, were it not absolutely necessary to transvaluate the inverted values back to “master” (not “slave”) morality in order to save whites from extinction, I wouldn’t have extended on Greg’s duplicity above. But see the opening words of chapter 56, “Old and New Tables” of Thus Spake Zarathustra, the new Moses:
Here do I sit and wait, old broken tables around me and also new half-written tables. When cometh mine hour?
Not yet at Counter-Currents… I’m afraid to say that its editor-in-chief seems to specialize in the mischievous art of having my cake and eating it too.
Brad Griffin (“Hunter Wallace”) is the administrator of the popular blogsite Occidental Dissent that focuses on the conflict between his beloved Dixie and the treasonous Yankees. In his recent discussion with Alex Linder, Brad challenged his opponent’s exterminationism with a very tough question:
Let’s suppose you were handed a Glock. There is a 6 year old female Jewish child in the room across the hallway. Could you walk into the room next door, point the gun at the child’s face, and pull the trigger? If so, how many times could you do it?
How many people here [VNN Forum] could do it? Anyone?
In the last few years Brad has also called Alex a “sociopath” precisely because of Alex’s “exterminationism” on a purely intellectual plane. And it’s worth noting that a couple of years ago, in an interview that Jim Giles apparently deleted, Brad issued the same challenge to Jim but this time imagining a hypothetical seven year-old Jewess (I remember so well the edge in Brad’s voice). Independently of what Alex and his henchmen at VNN Forum have said about Brad’s tough question, I’d like to respond to Brad directly:
I would not shoot the girl.
This said, final solutions on the millions of adults who pose serious threats to the fourteen words must be considered. My own preferred solution to the Jewish problem is stopping all Jewish immigration; designating Judaism as a political, endogamous, racial evolutionary strategy hostile to the West—instead of a just another “religious faith”—and placing legal restrictions on it throughout the White world; initiating Jew out-migration, and the quarantine of the Jewish people within Israel.
However, what bothers me, as I confessed in “Vanguardist poll,” is that apparently Jews have the right to openly and unabashedly fantasize about exterminating us (“The best of the Goyim must be destroyed”—The Talmud), while, at the same time, whites feel extremely dismayed when one of us dares to return the favor.
Yesterday Jim Giles interviewed Kevin and directly asked the professor what does he think about Alex’s exterminationist anti-Semitism. The show reminded me Jim’s now deleted interview of Brad two years ago, when Brad pleaded to save the little, thoroughly hypothetical Jewess with anguished edges in his voice. Since then, Jim has revisited his previous tolerance of Alex’s exterminationism and is now dismayed that Alex and a few of his VNN commenters openly advocate permanently getting rid of the subversive tribe.
In yesterday’s interview, Kevin told Jim that Alex’s exterminationist position is “pretty crazy and counterproductive.” The good professor also said: “That’s the kind of thing that I think is absolutely detrimental,” and used the term “black eye” as to how would nationalists be seen in public relations after such pronouncements.
VNN Forum of course takes the opposite stance. In one of the threads commenting these inter-blogs exchanges a Serbian wrote, “White nationalism shouldn’t be about ‘appealing’ to the impotent, superstitious, feminine and mentally sterile. Whites need leaders who think like jews, not christ morons.”
Well, while I see the point in the recent Jim Giles show, it still bothers me that the West tolerates anti-White exterminationist pronouncements by the Jews while, at the same time, it freaks out when hearing that someone of us advocates exterminationist anti-Semitism.
A chutzpahthic double-standard!
40 replies on “On exterminationist anti-Semitism”
Mohammed Merah did exactly that. Kill a little Jewish girl. The original Mohammed would have tried intercourse. Somehow, Khaybar didn’t leave the wound in the Jewish psyche the actions of Hitler did. Baruch Efrati does seem to exceptionally angry at Christian killing of Jewish women and children.
However, it seems the Old Testament does set the tone when it comes to full extermination, ironically “justified” by idolatrous child sacrifice.
Reblogged this on oogenhand and commented:
Impotent fantasizing. Atheism won’t break religion. Other religion will break religion.
Thanks for reblogging but no: in this rationalistic age no new religion will be formed. If you want a myth to replace the current myth, a numinous NS (like the SS in Nuremberg) is the answer.
Don’t forget this gem made by a jew professor:
……… So you see, jews have indeed a long history of advocating extermination of our White people, and if any of us oppose this planned “destruction”, we are called ‘ ‘White supremacist’ and ridiculed or worse.
I have a high respect for Linder and Griffin and I respect the contentious disagreement. However, one must acknowledge the truth of Linder’s termite analogy, which is his signature at VNN as follows
You see there is a major difference that we can appreciate between our side which is defensive and the jews whom actively seek to destroy, demoralize and subjugate us.
Now in my opinion, I would say deportation/expulsion of jews is the priority, but I CAN see the legitimacy in Linder’s point of view.
However, I cannot predict what ecological consequence might arise from exterminating the termite entirely as they may be an important food source to some animals, but I don’t want them in my home. Likewise, the jew must be dealt with somehow and its shame we harp on hypothetical poor victims when we should be rounding them up and shipping them off to Israel with extreme prejudice.
There is just the little problem of Israeli nukes. I hate tell you atheists, but only the terror of Hell can persuade the nuke-boys.
Can you give the name/source for the ‘Jewish professor’ quote, I want to drop that little gem into a conversation or two. Thanks.
Perhaps he’s referring to Noel Ignatiev.
Exterminationist anti-Semites are offering a counsel of despair. The problem is surely that we have never managed to demolish the foundations of the Jewish cult. The Christian clergy couldn’t do it (wouldn’t even want to) and we haven’t managed to either. We have never broken their confidence. If we could there would be no need to adopt such extreme policies as extermination. Other non-white peoples have invaded Europe before now and been thrown back: the Arabs, the Turks, the Mongols, Who nowadays worries about the Mongols? The Jews are more difficult to tackle because of their dispersed state and their army of collaborators, but once they lose their hold upon the religiously devout they can be forced out just like those others. I agree Israel’s nukes are a problem. The Zohar even describes a situation where the great ingathering takes place while God rains fire from heaven upon the nations. So Israel’s WMDs would have to go. But as for exterminating the entire tribe, it is not the white way and it is not even necessary.
Oh, but the foundations of Talmudism can easily be shaken. Liberal Talmudism leaves some room for euthanasia, but thinks abortion is a holy ritual. Orthodox Talmudism frowns upon abortion, but freaks out on euthanasia. This combined means abortion is more accepted than euthanasia over the whole line of Talmudism. This means demographic skewing towards old, with predictable results. So, even if Talmudists nuke the earth and repopulate it from underground bunkers, their religion would again run into a demographic wall. Samson is by definition compatible with the Old Testament, but less compatible with Talmudic ethics. Hell is eternal, another doctrine not well developed in either the Old Testament, or the Talmud, but a stark reality nonetheless.
Finally, the rapidly breeding Ultra-Orthodox, who do nothing but breeding and studying Talmud, will cause severe problems for Israel. Only by giving up their core values will Israel be able to do something about them.
We shouldn’t even be debating exterminationism openly. and if asked, I would agree with Kevin Macdonald.
These sort of debates undermine our cause. A lot of people probably do in fact have murder in their hearts, given the level of rage we all feel. But they should not be talking about it. The Muslims figured out how to deal with this problem — Taqqiyah:
What is Taqqiyah?
And as a contributor to this site has pointed out:
Agreed, but it still is bothersome that the tribe is allowed to speak openly about exterminating us in fashioned Israeli magazines while, at the same time, it’s considered beyond the pale to return the favor in obscure Gentile blogs.
I have touched on some of this subject here:
Thanks for sharing, Brandon.
Do you see any difference in Orthodox Chistianity and the Roman / Protestant?
If you’re addressing Oggenhand you should have had to click the reply button within his above comment.
It’s interesting that Linder still reverts to a moral basis (self-defense) for the extermination policy. Even so, Chechar’s plan does seem the most logical and fair, which makes me wonder why certain others push such an ‘extreme’ position.
The Christian-zionists are certainly morons but it would be easier to promote the deportation plan using the bible as justification rather than running around calling them names etc. Griffin was right about one thing… nobody wants to be in a community with the strange characters that populate VNN.
People who did not grow up in a really Christian home (be it Evangelical or Catholic) have no idea of what it is like to live in the shadow of the perpetual threat of Hell in case you deviate from the Christian doctrine.
The concept of Hell is not only completely absurd, it is deeply immoral. I would argue it is the single most immoral idea someone ever came up with. Perhaps the best illustration of the absurdity and immorality of the notion of Hell ever attempted is the long sermon about the eternity of sufferings that Hell entails preached by a Jesuit priest in a passage of Joyce’s A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man (see this passage in case here).
White Nacionalists and the few non Whites who support the White Nationalist cause (like me) should forsake Christianity altogether not just because of its false and immoral core teaching (i.e. that all human beings who die as non worshipers of the Jew Jesus will be tortured forever in an afterlife, regardless of the individual’s charater or deeds during his/her lifetime) but because a Racialist Christianity is a non sequitur. According to Paul, there are no Jews or Greeks before Christ, just Christians. As far as Christianity is concerned, Whites can mongrelize themselves with niggers rank and file and their descendents can go live in caves — it is not an issue PROVIDED THAT they are all good Jesus worshipers. This sinister and charlatan ideology is absolutely incompatible with any (non Jewish) racial awareness and I can’t understand how a number of WNs can’t see it.
It looks like we are increasingly on the same page on a number of topics. Although I liked Roger’s comment above yours, I had to delete another of his recent comments—:
—because he seems to be totally clueless about the inferno that that doctrine has caused in the mental health of true believers, including myself.
That’s precisely the subject-matter of the final chapter of my confessional book, Hojas Susurrantes (Rustling Leaves). At a mere essayistic level, I’ve also written on the subject of this most immoral idea in the whole history of the white race here, an essay on Erasmus that if I remember correctly you have already read.
My book is in Spanish but I wish it was translated to Portuguese. In it I mention a National Geographic image that caused a deep impression in the youth I was: a Fatima gathering with a woman crying and praying among the crowd to be saved from the fires of hell.
In Hojas Susurrantes I also try to answer the question, Why mankind worships such a horrible God?
There are two extreme positions at work. Burn in Hell for eternity vs Do as though wilt is the whole of the law. Obviously a fundamentalist fear of brimstone is destructive, especially for a child but to fear/dismiss the prospect of ‘moral accountability’ is the sign of a far more sicker mind.
Not being able to take a reasoned position on this subject is why complete breakdowns occur and why the West is the way it is.
This is astounding news about Johnson.
You say Alas for Greg, the lecture was recently “outed” in the pro-white community, much to his embarrassment.
Do you have a link to where Johnson addresses the contradiction of his being a member of the Swedenborgian church and his anti-Christian commentary?
If I remember correctly the outing originally appeared this year at VNN and then Brad Griffin wrote an article, “Greg Johnson, the Christian” at OD. It was in that thread that Greg complained and tried to offer his explanation. Greg never denied that the audio voice was his own. But he pleaded so well that Brad changed the name of the article to something else. If you cannot find it thru google you may email Brad and ask him where’s the thread. Hopefully Brad has not deleted it in spite of the fact that, IIRC Greg wanted the whole thing obliterated.
I will not email Griffin as the man truly is a mental case and I want nothing whatsoever to do with him.
I listened to Johnson’s “homily” ha ha last night, and it is definitely him. I’ll jewgle up the OD thread shortly.
I’ve searched but cannot find Johnson’s explanation anywhere.
He really needs to explain it, as he looks like a complete hypocrite now. Not just that, but also duplicitous.
I found the thread.
This is the article that was originally titled “Greg Johnson, the Christian”. Pay special attention to Greg’s words: “Hunter, do me a favor and delete this thread. The title alone is deeply distasteful to me.”
So although I am not a Swedenborgian minister, I did a pretty good imitation of one from time to time.
You can say that again! Or, as Johnson says at the end of his homily, “Amen”, lol.
When I moved into open White Nationalism, I wanted to maintain a separation between Greg Johnson the White Nationalist and my earlier intellectual interests and affiliations, …
Wait a minute. Johnson’s homily “Still and Always” was given “December 19, 2010” (link)
When did Johnson move into “open White Nationalism”? I like the qualifier “open”, it gives him some wriggle room.
Still reading that thread, and I can say, so far I’m not impressed with the explanation given.
I also knew that they would in all likelihood come out because of malicious mental defectives in the White Nationalist camp, and I was right.
Pffft. The only “mental defective” is Griffin, at whose site Johnson seeks protection. Oh the irony.
This is not a matter of “outing”, but actually requiring an explanation for all his anti-Christian abuse and hectoring, yet the whole time he’s been giving homilies at a so called Christian church.
Upshot though, it doesn’t matter in the wider necessity of remaining on-song with regard our goal: our racial preservation and advancement.
I am not impressed either; that’s why I subtitled this post, “The art of having my cake and eating it too”.
Greg Johnson says:
August 7, 2012 at 3:07 am
Hunter, do me a favor and delete this thread. The title alone is deeply distasteful to me.
Griffin: Hunter Wallace says:
August 7, 2012 at 3:32 am
I will edit the OP and turn this into a response to the Holocaust debate at TOO. We can sandbox the thread later or prune out the Swedenborg stuff.
The “mental defective” (what Johnson called Griffin), does what he’s told.
When I discovered that thread I was really shocked about Greg’s living a double life.
Mate, I’m shocked and disturbed.
As you point out in that thread, Johnson has made it his online goal to blame Christianity for everything that has come about today. He has harangued Christians, throws up philosophical “gotchas!” to confuse and undermine them, and the whole time he’s been preaching at a so called Christian church.
Why can’t he extend to us the courtesy he extends to his Swedenborgian brethren?
But the Swedenborgians are really nice people, and after I departed PSR, I still retained friends within the Swedenborgian world, …
They were “nice”, so he preached amongst them, while abusing us, who actually are on his side. The difference is, obviously so, that the Swedenborgians are very open-minded. In other words, they don’t have any problems with Johnson being a homosexualist, whereas the Catholic Church, of which he used to be a member, and student I believe, is not “open minded” when it comes to his advocacy.
Anyway, in the long run this doesn’t matter so long as he continues to advocate on our behalf, which he does well, mostly.
Still, he may like to extend some courtesy and understanding of our faith to us, just as he does to his Swedenborgian “open minded” brethren.
Sometimes I wonder who really is Greg Johnson. Do you think that he spares the Swedenborgians because they tolerate homos at San Fran? If this is so it looks like all of Greg’s hidden policies have to do with a homosexualist subagenda at CC. But again, all of this is speculation. I wish someone would provide reliable info about this guy, starting with a photo and a short bio, etc. What is he hiding?
Well, I don’t know GJ anymore than you do, matter of fact you would know him better.
My impression is that a) he’s an intellectual, ex-leftist, who is attracted to mysticism. He was also involved with studying Catholicism at some stage, and may be baptised Catholic. This means that he pursues intellectual and academic methods for understanding himself and the world about him. At some stage he’s been awakened to the fact that the world about him is hell-bent on White genocide, with most of our traditional White institutions overtly complicit in our destruction. Thus his academic, theory based, pursuit of White Nationalism.
b) He’s homosexual. He fears “homophobia” and naturally wants any sort of opposition to his sexuality being expunged from the movement. Not only does he want to negate opposition to homosexuality with WN, he desires a place for homosexuals at the vanguard of a White revolution. Hence his promotion of other homosexual writers at his blog. Thus also his promotion of James O’Meara’s perverse reading of a Männerbund.
I don’t think he is “hiding” as such, nor has a sub-agenda. It’s simply that is happily homosexual and wants everyone else to accept that, yet knows that the great majority of WNs would oppose expressed homosexuality, especially as some sort of Männerbund.
Do you think that he spares the Swedenborgians because they tolerate homos at San Fran?
Yes. They not only tolerate, but also perform homosexual marriage ceremonies, from what I read in the links. Their religion itself tappeals to his mysticism.
Don’t forget, GJ regards moral opposition to homosexual practice as coming from the Old Testament. That is a driving force in his opposition to traditional Catholicism and painting it with a broad brush as a form of Old Testament, Jew inspired moral suppression of what are his natural tendencies.
I should add, Chechar, that no matter that GJ and his crew are homosexuals, they have our interests at heart.
So, I wouldn’t be driving them out of us, just like I wouldn’t drive out Linder for his non-expedient “exterminationist” mindset.
We need and love all these fellas, we have nothing else.
Let a thousand flowers blossom, but what Greg et al are doing these days at CC in regard to James O’Meara’s homosexualism is detrimental to the mental health of San Fran. I speak as someone who has lived in the Bay Area and have noted the huge cultural differences between some places of Marin County and the Sin City.
Johnson says in that VNN thread:
Whites have become a morally sick, rotten race because of our acceptance of Christian morality and its secular offshoots…
This is something that you, Linder, and just about every big-name WN says, and it simply isn’t true.
Orthodox, traditional Christianity was defeated in WWII, sacked, and was turned over in service to the new Judeo-American empire.
Christian churches are in decline throughout the White West, since WWII, and with its decline has been the increase of a “a morally sick, rotten race” religion of Jewish liberalism. That liberalism is a pseudo Christianity foisted upon our people. It is a piñata which you and others strike at constantly, as if it were the real enemy.
Whites control nothing. Not even their own 2000 year old faith, and yet we are supposed to be believe that it is because of some Jew loving fault that’s been there at its inception. No matter that one of the major premises of that faith was rejection of the Jews, for their rejection of Christ.
It wasn’t until Calvin and then Cromwell, that this faith was turned over to the Jews, and we see its apogee of self-annihilation at the hands of the Jews in the Puritan inspired, Jew worshiping, mainstream “morally sick, rotten race” religion of Judeo-America that has been exported throughout our nations.
WWII, the fratricidal war that it was, was not only for the benefit of Jews, but also in concert with the trajectory of Protestantism as practiced in the U.S.A. since its birth. You look at all the Catholic inspired fascist nations that have been attacked (Mussolini, Hitler, Salazar, Franco – and could add Pinochet) and then see that this was more than for the Jews, it was a Protestant rejection of Catholic socialism for their true religion of money worship, usury, and their true god, The Economy.
Btw, Chechar, I am sorry for abusing you at OO ages ago. I shouldn’t have made it personal, and stuck to the topic instead.
All the best mate, and Merry Christmas to you and yours.
You’re doing great work here which I very much appreciate.
Brad Griffin’s last entry at OD also challenges this notion. But I don’t believe that Christianity is the main enemy: interbreeding caused by whites’ universalism and weak ethnocentrism is.
Take a look at the prologue of Arthur Kemp’s book that still appears in the first page of WDH and see what I mean. Pace monocausalists, the truth is that whites have been committing racial suicide since the last millennia. No kidding.
And apology accepted btw…
Brad Griffin’s last entry at OD also challenges this notion.
Brad Griffin is an idiot. The idiocy is caused by his mental instability. Not all he says is stupid, he’s an intelligent man at times, but overall he exhibits major defects, no doubt caused by his bi-polar condition.
That this weirdo has become a name in WN says all you need to know about much of online WN.
interbreeding caused by whites’ universalism and weak ethnocentrism is.
If Whites were so universalist with a weak ethnocentrism we would have a peaceful history of 2,000 years. We don’t. It is marked by wars over economy, ideology as reflected in our religions, and inter-ethnic fighting.
Catholicism vs Protestantism is a form of ethnic warfare. We just pretend it is about religion, without acknowledging that religion is a manifestation of race within environment, like culture is. In other words, religion is an expression of ethnicity.
whites have been committing racial suicide since the last millennia.
That’s not true. The last millennia saw White nations rapid rise to the apex of world civilising force. Whites did not consider other non-White ethnicity because they were not in contact with it, in their own nations.
It has only been the post WWII period that has seen this massive influx of non-Whites into our nations, and this is because the victors have mandated it, propagandised it, enforced it. The religion of the world today is a bastard child of Calvinism, what is Judeo-American racial dissipation, individualism, worship of The Economy, and subservience to their crucified Lord: the Jews.
I sent you an email btw.
I see what you mean.
A civilization “rises and falls” by its racial homogeneity and nothing else. As long as it maintains its racial homogeneity, it will last—if it loses its racial homogeneity, and changes its racial makeup, it will “fall” or be replaced by a new culture.
Yes, very true.
Perhaps now that we are faced with the threat of non-Whites in our nations we might evolve our religions into one that understands the primary necessity of racial homogeneity.
It’s a little more complex than that. One of the things I liked of Brad is that he recently studied the French Revolution and he claims that all the current liberal agenda that has been destroying us since WW2 was already implemented during the French reign of terror—granting citizenship to blacks, runaway egalitarianism; I mean, even sending blonds to the guillotine and siding the rioting blacks in Haiti.
I try to explain the whole etiology of all of this mess in “Witches brew”, which considers most of the ingredients that are poisoning whites.